Engaged/Married - How can I protect myself from a suspected rat?

Etoyoc

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Well it is the fact that you cannot prove the absense of bezness, but you can prove positive. Especially "letting someone else call in an attractive way" leads in most cases to some valueable insights, namely if conducted by a tunisian girl...
 
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Veritas

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Well it is the fact that you cannot prove the absense of bezness, but you can prove positive. Especially "letting someone else call in an attractive way" leads in most cases to some valueable insights, namely if conducted by a tunisian girl...
Hmmm............would that rattle me if, I was a rat?? Not really.
Depending on experience and perseverance they have their ways of wriggling themselves out of trouble.
I still believe it's only a case of primary intentions, whether feelings & relationship are truthful and/or luck. So on this occasion, I'm gonna have to disagree with you.
 
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Caramel

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If you decide to have children, think carefully about having them in Tunisia. You will need permission from your husband to take that child out of the country, for say a holiday, and if there is a custory battle in a divorce, the Tunisian man always invariably wins. If you were a Tunisian woman, you might stand a better chance, but as a foreign woman, your chance is almost zero .
 
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Caramel

Guest
If you have children or considerably assets, research carefully the kind of marriage contract you want to draw up. In most cases the Tunisian man who choses to marry a foreigner, will not have much to share with you, so he stands to gain on marriage to you.

If you decide to draw up a contract that will protect your assets, and he argues against this, run for the hills. Because if he really cares for you, he will see your point and not try to persuade you from doing this.

Also make sure that contract is translated to you before you sign anything as very often this is in Arabic and you really dont know what you are agreeing to. It will be too late to close the 'barn door after the horse has bolted' then.
 

Tunisianbelle

'Don't call me Darling!' Mod
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If you decide to have children, think carefully about having them in Tunisia. You will need permission from your husband to take that child out of the country, for say a holiday, and if there is a custory battle in a divorce, the Tunisian man always invariably wins. If you were a Tunisian woman, you might stand a better chance, but as a foreign woman, your chance is almost zero .
This has been discussed at length in other threads, but.....

No matter where you have your child, when in Tunisia they are considered Tunisian and must abide by Tunisian law. That means that the should carry their own Tunisian passport (or be put on the passport of the Tunisian parent), and if traveling without the father, they would need written permission to leave the country.

Of course there are always people who say they have had no problems not having a Tunisian passport for their child, etc, but the reality stand that should the customs agents want to follow the exact letter of the law, it could mean you having to stay in Tunisia until a passport for your child can be obtained. Same goes for not having a letter of authorization. And in fact, I know a British woman who has kids, born in the UK - by a British father - who is asked each time she leaves Tunisia (she lives here) for the letter of authorization.


Also, just because you are a foreign parent does not mean you have less rights to your kids. However, you would need to know the law and be ready to stay living in Tunisia so that the father can have easy access to his children. The thing for foreign mothers that can be hard, is that according to the law, the children should be brought up by the Muslim parent. If the women is not Muslim, she could have a harder time getting custody.

It is always best if the father and mother, in the event of a divorce, can put the interests of the children first and come up with an agreement that works for everyone.
 
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Caramel

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What happens if the foreign woman cannot afford to live in Tunisia with her children? How is it in the interest of the children if she is forced through economic reasons to leave her children behind? And can I ask you which Tunisian man concerning his children is going to negotiate with you, especially after the relationship has broken down?
 
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WouldI

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This is why threads such as this are important because issues such as this need careful consideration before marriage (particularly if the couple intend to have children). It's common for people to marry relatively soon after starting a relationship (and I'm not knocking it because I did too :ben:), but I really wish that more women would prioritise thinking about this kind of stuff before looking for a wedding dress - these are such massive issues, and can cause problems within a marriage if not discussed beforehand. How many stories have we read where people just aren't aware of any of the legal issues around children, assets etc. or even the practicalities and stresses a couple face when they progress from quarterly holidays together in the sunshine to living together (and pulling together) in 'real' life. Most of us marrieds seem to have experienced things that have tested our relationships (a lot of it relating to mutual adjustments, finances etc.) and I think it's really important that we balance out the romantic, love-story type stuff with the reality - so, my advice to the lovers would be to thrash as much out as possible before signing on the dotted line! :ben:
 
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Caramel

Guest
This is why threads such as this are important because issues such as this need careful consideration before marriage (particularly if the couple intend to have children). It's common for people to marry relatively soon after starting a relationship (and I'm not knocking it because I did too :ben:), but I really wish that more women would prioritise thinking about this kind of stuff before looking for a wedding dress - these are such massive issues, and can cause problems within a marriage if not discussed beforehand. How many stories have we read where people just aren't aware of any of the legal issues around children, assets etc. or even the practicalities and stresses a couple face when they progress from quarterly holidays together in the sunshine to living together (and pulling together) in 'real' life. Most of us marrieds seem to have experienced things that have tested our relationships (a lot of it relating to mutual adjustments, finances etc.) and I think it's really important that we balance out the romantic, love-story type stuff with the reality - so, my advice to the lovers would be to thrash as much out as possible before signing on the dotted line! :ben:
Great post - well said.
 

Tunisianbelle

'Don't call me Darling!' Mod
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What happens if the foreign woman cannot afford to live in Tunisia with her children? How is it in the interest of the children if she is forced through economic reasons to leave her children behind? And can I ask you which Tunisian man concerning his children is going to negotiate with you, especially after the relationship has broken down?
Like Woodz said, it is a very unfortunate situation and couples need to discuss the hard truths before thinking about the marriage and only the happy times.

I don't know about any other couple and what they have decided upon, but my husband and I have already said that should we ever split up, I would get the kids because his job is very demanding and he works long hours, frequently having rotations which take him out of town and even out of country. However he would want to see his children as much as possible and I would never deny him that because he is a wonderful father who loves his kids more than life itself.

I am not sure if women know this or not, but you can make a pre-nup or post-nup (which ever is legal in your country) that outlines specific details of what will happen should you two divorce. This can include division of marital and separate assets as well as intentions for the children. Get it translated into English as well as having the first copy in either French or Arabic (that way it can never be said one party did not understand something), have both parties sign both copies and have both copies notarized. As long as the document is fair (one person does get everything or all benefits while the other gets little to nothing) then the courts will hold it in high regard and are more likely to uphold the agreement.
 
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Caramel

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Never thought prenups worked in Tunisia. I dont think so somehow. It still means that you will not be able to leave Tunisia with your kids. You will be stuck there until they are of age. I think this is correct but stand to be corrected.

Although he may be busy in his job, if he decides that he really wants his kids, he can get a housekeeper or mis mother to look after them, and I am nearly 100% sure the court will rule in his favour. You may, however, stand a better chance now that you are a muslim (am I correct in this assumption?) but I still think it will work in his favour if he pursues that route.
 

Tunisianbelle

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Messages
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Pre-nups do work in Tunisia. You can have it drawn up and referenced in your wedding contract. I am not 100% sure about the post-nup, but have a friend that has done one and she has been told as long as it's fair it should hold up.

Anyone can say anything they want about what they assume would happen, and they may be right or wrong. But I know my husband and he is a very honorable man and never goes back on his word. Since we have already talked about, and made provisions for what would happen in the event of a divorce, I am confident that what we decided on is what would happen. I have his word, and a legal document to reassure me.

But quite honestly, if I were to get divorced, I would not want to leave Tunisia. I love living here, this is my childrens home, this is a place where it would serve the best interests of my children to have full and easy access to both parents, and I have other expat friends (some married to Tunisians, others not) who live here and enjoy it just as much as I do.
 
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Caramel

Guest
Thats fine, in your case it is really good and you have obviously spent a lot of time preparing for eventualities. As WouldI said, couples should do their homework and you certainly have. Thats why its good to have discussions on here, because I have learnt one thing today about the prenups standing up. This is indeed a good safeguard for any couple, but it really has to have the agreement of both people. If agreement cannot be reached, then the couple must think twice about a marriage commitment.

I would also go as far to say that if anyone is thinking of drawing one up, perhaps you could give them some guidance.

Thank you for this.
 
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Mona1

Guest
I think WouldI and TB have put it so well......discuss before marriage. I know many people seem to think it is unromantic to talk about money, divorce, what will happen with the children but sadly it is a sign or our times that many marriages, whether to Tunisians or any other nationality, end in divorce.

The dress and wedding are really so secondary to what will happen after the ceremony that I would have thought a week set aside to sort out basics is time well spent.
 
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Caramel

Guest
I think WouldI and TB have put it so well......discuss before marriage. I know many people seem to think it is unromantic to talk about money, divorce, what will happen with the children but sadly it is a sign or our times that many marriages, whether to Tunisians or any other nationality, end in divorce.

The dress and wedding are really so secondary to what will happen after the ceremony that I would have thought a week set aside to sort out basics is time well spent.
I totally agree with you 100%.
 
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DinkyDog

Guest
I think I have learnt more on this thread than I have in my life so far...

Thanks everyone!!!
 
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Caramel

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Never give an updated birth certificate to your husband as he needs it if he is going to divorce you secretly. Mine asked for my birth cert under the pretence of adding my name to our properties in Tunisia. Little did I know that he was divorcing me behind my back!
 
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Caramel

Guest
If you marry or divorce your partner in your home country, make sure your certificates have been registered in his country. If he is reluctant to do this, employ a local lawyer to effect this. If this is not done in the case of marriages abroad, he can quite easily conduct a second marriage without your knowledge and be leading a double life, one in his country and the other in yours.

When it is convenient for him and also when he has squeezed enough money, visas, etc out of you, he will divorce you in your country and you will never know what happened in his country. Beware he will use the law in his country to suit himself and the law in yours to the same end, when appropriate.
 
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