Psychological tips

Brasilgirl

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Feb 28, 2018
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2,623
Great find....and so true, it’s pretty frightening! I found all those ‘Hi’ messages on his phone....he’d send about twenty/thirty a day and wait to see who replied. I wish I’d been like the majority of others he tried with....and ignored him.

Did have a little giggle at this though:

View attachment 55734
It’s so true!! :rolleyes::D:D
Or when I would say something and challenge him and he would scroll back and take a screen shot of what I said out of context, and I would see two active SIM cards and over 40 messages unread shown on the top of the screen! That’s actually messages from over 40 people unread in his messenger! I didn’t point it out to him until the end, but I knew for a long time. I just needed to beleive it. My heart was playing tricks on me.
 

AmberHeart

Lady Amberheart of Gafsa
Joined
Jul 13, 2018
Messages
4,593
Great find....and so true, it’s pretty frightening! I found all those ‘Hi’ messages on his phone....he’d send about twenty/thirty a day and wait to see who replied. I wish I’d been like the majority of others he tried with....and ignored him.

Did have a little giggle at this though:

View attachment 55734
It’s so true!! :rolleyes::D:D
Guess what i realised... The engagement date with ex and mine are on the same day but she was on 2016 mine was on 2017... How clever so we all are habibi, baby and got engaged same day to not forget anniversary...
 

Epiphany

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Sep 30, 2018
Messages
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Manipulating is their hobby.
I have been in a bad place lately, never been feeling so low. Think the reality what has been happening to me for the last years with rat has sunk in.
The more I read here the more I realize that he never loved me for one minute, he used and abused me, he told me lie after lie.
I have been so low that I started crying when somebody at work asked a simple question and I just lost it. I think the poor man is still upset about it.
Normally when something happens I get back up, dust myself off and get on with real life.
Somehow my rat does sense this and tries to reel me back into his rat life.
Sadly for me he just lives around the corner so sometimes I bump into him.
Hugs
 

Brasilgirl

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Joined
Feb 28, 2018
Messages
2,623
Manipulating is their hobby.
I have been in a bad place lately, never been feeling so low. Think the reality what has been happening to me for the last years with rat has sunk in.
The more I read here the more I realize that he never loved me for one minute, he used and abused me, he told me lie after lie.
I have been so low that I started crying when somebody at work asked a simple question and I just lost it. I think the poor man is still upset about it.
Normally when something happens I get back up, dust myself off and get on with real life.
Somehow my rat does sense this and tries to reel me back into his rat life.
Sadly for me he just lives around the corner so sometimes I bump into him.
** big hugs **
These guys do get under your skin and they are hard to get out. It’s the brain washing.
Stay strong. It’s okay to cry.
** hugs **
 

AmberHeart

Lady Amberheart of Gafsa
Joined
Jul 13, 2018
Messages
4,593
Manipulating is their hobby.
I have been in a bad place lately, never been feeling so low. Think the reality what has been happening to me for the last years with rat has sunk in.
The more I read here the more I realize that he never loved me for one minute, he used and abused me, he told me lie after lie.
I have been so low that I started crying when somebody at work asked a simple question and I just lost it. I think the poor man is still upset about it.
Normally when something happens I get back up, dust myself off and get on with real life.
Somehow my rat does sense this and tries to reel me back into his rat life.
Sadly for me he just lives around the corner so sometimes I bump into him.
They dont quit trying to reel victims back that easy because they know we fell for it several times and they are only looking for a new chance to get something from it. Having the right info is crucial so we do know now how to close doors to them.
Vulnerability reveals your good heart, it is a process to let all toxocity out. Big hug.
 

DesertQuestion

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Joined
Sep 27, 2018
Messages
62
NARCISSISTIC AND EMOTIONAL ABUSE

NARCISSISTIC AND EMOTIONAL ABUSE
Providing Information And Support


RED FLAGS OF TOXIC PEOPLE
RED FLAGS OF TOXIC PEOPLE
June 3, 2017 Admin Comments 15 Comments


RED FLAGS OF TOXIC PEOPLE


Not all toxic people are narcissists but we still need to keep these people at arm’s length and not be drawn into their toxicity.



There are often red flags that we should never ignore which can tell us a lot about a person. How many times do we see something at the start of a relationship and ignore it thinking it was a ‘one off?’ By the time we see the next one, we’ve almost forgotten about the first! Please keep them logged in your head. One or two instances may not indicate that someone is truly toxic but when these little red flags are waved in front of you time and time again, they become a massive warning sign of a treacherous path ahead.



  1. This person makes you feel on edge. You can’t really put your finger on the reason but you’ve no doubt there’s something not quite right.
  2. They are rude or talk down to the waiter.
  3. They get too close far too soon. Love doesn’t normally work that way. It takes time for bonds to form and love to grow.
  4. They are charming to the point of being beyond the realms of normality. Trust that old saying, ‘If something appears too good to be true, it probably is.’
  5. They tell you of how their previous partners cheated, lied, were crazy etc. They play the victim and have got you feeling sorry for them. It wasn’t their fault. Yes, you’ve got it… They are the common denominator. They are likely to be the one with the problem.
  6. They have a short supply of genuine friends. Friends don’t usually hang around toxic people for lengthy periods of time.
  7. You do most of the talking. They do the listening, figuring you out, knowing your likes and dislikes so they can pretend to be the person you want them to be. However, once the relationship is established, they switch to talking about themselves which of course is a much more interesting subject!
  8. They criticise your friends and family hoping to create the division that will eventually lead to your isolation from everyone you once held dear.
  9. Although critical of others, they can’t stand a taste of their own medicine, being extremely sensitive to any form of criticism.
  10. You find yourself being compared to ex friends, ex partners and family.
  11. They rarely have anything good to say about anyone.
  12. You feel you have to walk on eggshells around this person.
  13. They demand most of your time.
  14. They hate to be alone. They need people to provide them with their much needed narcissistic supply. Perhaps being alone allows too much time for self – reflection.
  15. They don’t respect your boundaries.
  16. They use passive aggressive behaviour, such as the cold shoulder, stonewalling and the silent treatment for some perceived slight.
  17. They have an uncontrollable rage / anger.
  18. Pathological lying. They lie even when there’s absolutely no need to and truth would be a better option.
  19. They never accept responsibility for their faults or accept blame for anything untoward. Nothing is ever their fault.
  20. This person causes chaos where there was once peace and calm. (Divide and conquer).
  21. They lack morals yet expects yours to be high.
  22. They insult you and if you are offended, they tell you that you’re being much too sensitive.
  23. They suggest what you should wear, how you should do your hair… Once again, this is all about control.
  24. They show their true colours to you whilst maintaining their ‘charm’ to the outside world.
  25. They lack empathy and are either unable or unwilling to put themselves in someone else’s shoes.
  26. They are constantly seeking compliments.
  27. This person has a grandiose view of themselves. However, underneath their grandiosity, may lie a low self-esteem.
  28. They think that they have the ability to know what you are thinking. Only you know that.
  29. They are envious of others’ possessions and / or accomplishments.
  30. They like to be the centre of attention, expecting your praise for minor achievements; expecting their needs to be met, after all, they are much more important than yours.
  31. This person is a serial flirter.
  32. They show no remorse.
  33. If they treat you badly, you must have done something to deserve it!
  34. They have a strong sense of entitlement.
  35. They are jealous of close relationships that you may have.
  36. This person possesses the most fragile of egos.
  37. They acts like they are above the law, rules don’t apply to them.
  38. They rarely apologise, and if they do, it’s either insincere or in their best interests to do so.
  39. They believe they can only be understood by high achieving important people, like themselves.
  40. They are in good form one minute and in bad form the next.
  41. They hold grudges / hatred for a lifetime against those who they believe have wronged them in some way.
  42. They are preoccupied with their image, always wanting to look good in front of others.
  43. They don’t express genuine emotion.
In order to preserve your health and your sanity, keep your distance from toxic people and their flying monkeys as far as humanly possible. There are generally two sides to every story. There is the truth and then there is the toxic person’s version. Their version rarely comes close when it comes to the truth and their flying monkeys or enablers pass judgement without listening to both sides of the story. Be patient. No one can hide from the truth for ever.


Written by
Anne McCrea
I just want to say thank you for posting this.

One cool thing that has armed me against this is I was raised by a severely emotionally/ psychologically / verbally abusive stepmother. It's taken years of therapy to get out from under her clutches in my mind, but the benefit of largely recovering from that was that it could be currently saving me in my situation. I learned a lot of things from her about what narcissistic and toxic people do and how it feels to be manipulated. Compared to my (maybe, probably) rat, anything he does to me is like child's play compared to what I grew up with. It's like being raised by the actual devil and having learnt all her tricks, only to be challenged later by a lesser demon. Sometimes this experience gives me armor, because no matter what this dude has up his sleeve, it can't actually get worse (I hope!) than what this woman did to me as a child. So sometimes I just laugh at whatever he does because it's like ... try me, b*tch!! :D lol.
 

DesertQuestion

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Joined
Sep 27, 2018
Messages
62
I just want to say thank you for posting this.

One cool thing that has armed me against this is I was raised by a severely emotionally/ psychologically / verbally abusive stepmother. It's taken years of therapy to get out from under her clutches in my mind, but the benefit of largely recovering from that was that it could be currently saving me in my situation. I learned a lot of things from her about what narcissistic and toxic people do and how it feels to be manipulated. Compared to my (maybe, probably) rat, anything he does to me is like child's play compared to what I grew up with. It's like being raised by the actual devil and having learnt all her tricks, only to be challenged later by a lesser demon. Sometimes this experience gives me armor, because no matter what this dude has up his sleeve, it can't actually get worse (I hope!) than what this woman did to me as a child. So sometimes I just laugh at whatever he does because it's like ... try me, b*tch!! :D lol.
I mean, sometimes, whenever I don't accidentally succumb to it, that is. :( When I feel my own power, it's when I live inside of the realization that I've been through this shit before and survived.
 

Mango Chutney

Administrator.
Staff member
Joined
Aug 29, 2015
Messages
11,737
I just want to say thank you for posting this.

One cool thing that has armed me against this is I was raised by a severely emotionally/ psychologically / verbally abusive stepmother. It's taken years of therapy to get out from under her clutches in my mind, but the benefit of largely recovering from that was that it could be currently saving me in my situation. I learned a lot of things from her about what narcissistic and toxic people do and how it feels to be manipulated. Compared to my (maybe, probably) rat, anything he does to me is like child's play compared to what I grew up with. It's like being raised by the actual devil and having learnt all her tricks, only to be challenged later by a lesser demon. Sometimes this experience gives me armor, because no matter what this dude has up his sleeve, it can't actually get worse (I hope!) than what this woman did to me as a child. So sometimes I just laugh at whatever he does because it's like ... try me, b*tch!! :D lol.
Awww, you’re welcome :love:
You seem a little stronger :)

Your childhood sounds like mine, it makes us build walls....I let my walls down for the rat and he nearly killed me :rolleyes:
 

AmberHeart

Lady Amberheart of Gafsa
Joined
Jul 13, 2018
Messages
4,593
36367212_1985870421487988_8884359844295868416_n.jpg https://www.facebook.com/pg/thegreencarddiaries/about/?ref=page_internal

The Green Card Diaries~
A no holds barred story coming soon about the trials & tribulations of one woman's story: Going from a victim to a survivor of Marriage & Benefit Fraud and emotional abuse.
#speakup #speakout #ustoo #IfMyWoundsWereVisible

This is a FB page that has interesting links related to marriage fraud victims. always remember to protect your identity as a TLR member. xxxx
 

Mango Chutney

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Messages
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A really useful insight as to how the narcissist is created.
I wrote yesterday that a narcissist is not born a narcissist, it is a reaction to something from there children, that made their emotions detach.
Knowing the bits I know about

Houssem’s childhood, I can see why he developed his personality disorder. He often used to sit and tell me stuff, just little bits that make a whole when put together, plus I could see some bits myself.

Knowing the upbringing of Tunisian males, again, I can understand. Although mollycoddled by their mothers, there is a lot of pressure on them to succeed, to provide and to gain social acceptance.

Why Narcissists May Be So Jealous, Competitive, and Mean
Understanding the cause of competition and meanness makes coping easier.
Posted Jul 03, 2018



Source: Fizkes/Shutterstock
Severe narcissism is one of the most complex and confusing psychological phenomena, and its complexity explains why so much is written about it, and why there remains a need to continue educating the public about it. The focus of this article will be to address one facet of the disorder that remains so mysterious. Specifically, people who are in close proximity to severe narcissists often can't understand why the narcissist in their life can: be so mean; get so
jealous of their success or happiness; and be so competitive with them, even when we're talking about two romantic partners.

One word that will help you understand the narcissist

To begin, the most helpful word in framing an understanding of the narcissist is "counterintuitive." The most crucial point is that how the narcissist presents on the surface is entirely different from how the narcissist feels underneath. There are two "selfs" at work in the mind of the narcissist: their real self, and the fraudulent, fantasy self they try to sell to the public. Severe narcissists have a predatory, score-keeping approach to the social world around them. The narcissist's daily life is spent fighting off potential threats to their ego and proving themselves as superior to everyone around them, and they have little peace of mind as they move through life. To understand why the narcissist can be so mean in interpersonal relationships, you must understand the unique motivations of the narcissist's intra-psychic world or, in lay terms, what goes on inside the mind of a narcissist.

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Most, if not all, severe narcissists were likely emotionally injured at a crucial time in their development. Specifically, they were injured when they were young children, a time when a child is highly impressionable, and when that child hasn't yet figured out how to shore up psychological guards (defenses) to ward off things that make them feel bad. When the young boy or girl was emotionally injured, it probably took the following form: An authority figure or even bullying kids at schoolhumiliated them, subjugated them, knowingly neglected them, or otherwise exploited them. To become severely narcissistic later in life, the emotional injury in childhoodhad to be severe enough that the individual arrived at the following (unconscious) conclusion: No one will ever hurt me like that again; I will never let my guard down. Later in life, this way of relating to people and the world has been practiced over and over for so many years that the personality becomes largely locked into place, and it is extremely challenging for the narcissist to let themselves be exposed emotionally for very long at all. If someone or something threatens the narcissist's ego, the narcissist abruptly shifts into predator mode.

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Why narcissists can be so mean

In a moment, I will explain what happens when the narcissist shifts into predator mode. First, however, it is important to understand why the narcissist feels the need to fight so doggedly to begin with. In the mind of the narcissist, the social world includes two strict categories: winners and losers. There is no possible outcome they can conceive of in which everyone gets their needs met. There isn't enough attention and praise for everyone to go around, so according to narcissistic logic, only a few lucky ones will be selected. Because of the way the narcissist was probably humiliated, unnoticed, or subjugated in the past when it mattered most, the narcissist is also motivated by making sure that they are never put down or overlooked again. When the narcissist feels most threatened, it is because someone has said or done something that makes the narcissist feel small, unnoticed, weak, or defective, and the narcissist cannot allow anyone or anything to make him feel like that under any circumstances. The narcissist's thinking goes like this: Any threat to her or his temperamental ego must be identified and erased immediately. If the threat continues, it must be annihilated by any means necessary.

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If you put down the narcissist or humiliate them publicly, you will unleash decades-old rage, and the narcissist will not stop until they feel you have been verbally or emotionally decimated. (Keep in mind that what the narcissist perceives as a slight is rarely objective.) People who haven't been in close proximity to a severe narcissist would never believe the animalistic, ugly wrath that spews from the narcissist when they are activated. Many boys and girls, or men and women, who have suffered at the hands of an extreme narcissist talk about how seeing such hate-filled "colors" in another human being is traumatic in itself. (These same individuals also find it hard to ever emotionally trust someone again who shows such unbridled, predatory rage.)

If you are in close proximity to a severe narcissist, understand that the meanness and viciousness the narcissist displays when threatened or held accountable is not personal. Narcissists can use words as bullets, zeroing in on anything they can to unsettle and upset you. Being on the receiving end of this behavior is horrifying and confusing. The recipients often turn to self-helpbooks or articles (like this one) to make sense of the experience, because it is so traumatic and disturbing. Recipients often become sort of "armchair therapists," learning about this personality disorder and trying to become an expert on this type of personality to maintain their sanity. If you are in close proximity to a narcissist, I will highlight what is important for you to understand to move forward. At root, severe narcissists are highly abnormal men and women who have a form of mental illness (a personality disorder). The root of the disorder means that the narcissist, by definition, violates basic social rules and social conventions. When triggered, especially, they don't show empathy: They are entitled; they create their own reality from moment to moment; and they don't really care about others' feelings. The rules or social conventions that most elementary school children have already mastered are absent in the adult narcissist. I use the following expression with clients dealing with individuals like this: "They don't get it, but they also don't want to get it."

To understand why narcissists can be so mean, you must understand that there are no limits or boundaries when they get triggered (e.g., something makes them look bad, countering the false, impermeable image they desperately try to sell to themselves and to the world overall). Nothing is off-limits with the narcissist when they are upset. No one else in the room has feelings when the narcissist is overwhelmed by his or her own negative feelings. It's a true onslaught, and to see someone who supposedly cares about and loves you completely deny your — and everyone else's — reality and to rip you to shreds, at times, is simply par for the course. If narcissists were foods approved by the Food and Drug Administration, the sticker would read: "Can be extremely malicious and destructive when provoked." Perhaps some men and women can handle being occasionally treated in an abusive way, but I'm not sure that should be the goal. The goal isn't to steel yourself against a loved one to the point where nothing they say or do hurts you. Yes, you could play that game, but what's the point of investing in a relationship that has no real emotional intimacy? Moreover, what's the point in having a relationship with someone who violates basic social rules that most third graders already subscribe to?

Why narcissists are so competitive and can't let you, figuratively speaking, shine

Because the narcissist's emotional scar involved them being unnoticed, humiliated, or subjugated at a crucial point in their psychological development, the overall topic of succeeding, shining, or getting noticed is a so-called hot-button issue. It is a loaded issue, fraught with primitive and unconscious memories, thoughts, and feelings. So many people in close proximity to a severe narcissist feel confused about why the narcissist has such an intense and often negative reaction when the other person feels really good, succeeds, or shines. Here is where things get tricky, and highly personality-disordered. Oddly enough, the severe narcissist takes your success as a reflection on them, but not necessarily in the way that you might be imagining. The mind of the narcissist is a binary, all-or-nothing world. If you succeed, their twisted logic tells them that your success means they failed. Someone else succeeding or shining (especially someone close to them, whom they see all the time) is actually upsetting (even unconsciously painful), because they see your success as a missed opportunity for themselves to get a little love or attention. While most people rightly believe that there is enough of all the good stuff to go around — love, attention, respect — severe narcissists are convinced that only a select few will get recognized. Sadly, no amount of convincing will convince them otherwise. It is critical to understand that the narcissist isn't competitive with you, because they hate you or want to hurt you emotionally. They do what they do, because they are feeling emotionally deprived themselves.

Normal people are entirely confused about how the narcissist — or anyone, for that matter — can go through so much of their life without ever having learned and accepted some of the most fundamental social laws. Most third graders already understand and follow these basic social conventions, so it is almost hard to understand on a logical level how someone who looks like an adult and is not cognitively disabled could act so much like a child. This issue broaches the subject of another factor that underlies the disorder: oppositionality.

Oppositionality is an often overlooked part of the disorder.

Anecdotally, having worked with many children and teenagers who have Oppositional Defiant Disorder, I have noticed an interesting overlap between that disorder and adult Narcissistic Personality Disorder. The overlap is worth examining, because it will help you to see how so much of the narcissist's mental approach and behavior is inherently oppositional under the surface.

Oppositional Defiant Disorder (known as ODD in clinical circles) is a mental disorder seen in school-aged children. The diagnosis includes the following criteria: often loses temper; often argues with adults; often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults’ requests or rules; often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior; is often angry and resentful; and is often spiteful or vindictive. If you are in close proximity to a narcissist, you see the shared characteristics.

Children who have oppositional, defiant personalities and adults who have narcissistic personalities are the way they are for a reason. There is no strict biological basis for these complex, difficult personalities. Perhaps biology plays a role, but my many years of experience with clients has shown that something in the individual's emotional relationships early in life was usually a major contributor (unhealthy parenting approaches, trauma, etc.). The point is that the narcissist's personality got constructed in a highly defensive way. For a personality to become so resistant, difficult, and all-around abnormal, something abnormal in the individual's past had to take place over a significant length of time or during an especially critical period in that individual's development (perhaps within the first several years of life, or what many birth to five experts call the "critical period").

For those in close proximity to the severe narcissist, they must understand what, again, is counterintuitive. In other words, how the severe narcissist acts with you often — especially when their ego or sense of power has been threatened — has nothing to do with you.

What kind of a relationship can you have with a severe narcissist?

Given the highly abnormal relationship dynamic a narcissist requires, what kind of relationship can you have with a severe narcissist? The answer isn't simple. If you don't emotionally trigger the narcissist, you can have a semblance of a relationship. There won't be real intimacy — because intimacy is about equals, and narcissists can't do that, no matter what — but you can coexist. But if you are someone who feels good about yourself, gets noticed and praised by others, and holds themselves or anyone else accountable for major social or relationship violations, there can usually be no relationship. To make it work with a narcissist, you must alter your entire line of thinking with them in the this way: They have the power, they are in control, and they matter more. Without adopting this skewed, counterintuitive framework, the narcissist, from time to time, will always end up making you pay a price for the self-esteem you have.

To read about specific visualization techniques you can use to keep the peace with a narcissist, read my article on the subject here.
 

Mango Chutney

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Just read this on a FB group I joined shortly after leaving rat. It’s an interesting read, and helpful for anybody going through the hell that is the recovery process.
Remember, it is not your fault! Where abuse is involved, albeit physical, sexual, mental, financial, spiritual etc......the fault never, ever lies with the victim....

A6B497FF-E51B-4291-9819-E5AB4AD44940.jpeg


“You unknowingly lived and loved what can only be described as an abhorrent liar and con artist – but you believed in them completely and spent a great deal of time and energy supporting, nurturing and developing this relationship. So, to start off you are not grieving a relationship that is traditional by any means – you are grieving an abusive and desperate love! Not only are you dealing with a lie, but with a creature that has damaged your life and abused your love – BUT again you BELIEVED in this person that completely destroyed you and probably took your integrity along for the ride. YOU are not at fault for any of this – NOBODY deserves to be lied to, conned, OR abused for any reason.

Now the truth is standing directly in front of you and you must SOMEHOW process this without any experience to do so. Where do you begin and how do you grieve this abusive relationship? You try to approach it like a normal relationship, BUT there is nothing even near normal about it. You have to make sense out of a love you BELIEVED was real, but it was a lie AND it was abuse. The two don’t go hand in hand. You can’t realistically find common ground to separate and actualize these two facts because they are so polar opposite and it feels impossible to work with this because you only end up conflicted.

On top of it all this abuse has left you vulnerable, traumatized and disabled. Today you stand at the bottom of a dark void looking for the smallest ray of light, but you are buried by so many layers of confusion that it feels impossible to do anything but remain there and wait for something or someone to help you or even save you. You can’t apply a traditional grieving process to any of this because you have been managed down from the abuse, you are traumatized and a shell of the person you once were. You are not moving on with a clear perspective and mutual and respectful understanding that the relationship failed, you are moving on from an abusive situation. YOU ARE NOT AT FAULT – so start there to get you healthy power back!

Even the people nearest and dearest to you can only console you from their point of view that doesn’t have the smallest connection to understanding this abuse. They don’t even know that you have fallen so deeply into this void. If you would have actually fallen into a hole the first thing you would do is use your voice and cry out for help! This is what you must actualize as the first step to moving forward – your voice is integral in getting a message out to the world that you need help, so you CAN connect to the very people that have experience to help you UNDERSTAND this! You cannot isolate yourself and remain in the fog any longer – this is YOUR time to survive and even thrive in time!

The very next thing that you have to actualize at some point is that there is absolutely nothing that you can do to try to make this love (be it a relationship or family member) real again by returning to it for any reason. You can’t fix the Narcissist that did this to you, relate to them in any manner, and or be in any contact with them anymore UNLESS it is an absolute necessity. You must also get them out of your thoughts as in TRYING to figure this out. Their words (and actions of course) are what abused you in the first place, so they have no sympathy as it concerns your situation because they purposely put you there. YES, this is excruciatingly painful to accept and nearly impossible to believe BUT you have to put yourself in the reality that this person (the Narcissist) is dangerous and you deserve so much more than this.

This is what defines the non-traditional breakup with these creatures. It is not a straightforward recovery, but instead one that requires a strong dose of education as well as a strong arm to pull the target/victim out of darkness and despair with therapy, support and all the help that is available. You are NOT just grieving a relationship, you are grieving so much personal destruction from abuse! No/minimal contact to START this journey.”
 

juicyfruit

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 10, 2017
Messages
1,021
Just read this on a FB group I joined shortly after leaving rat. It’s an interesting read, and helpful for anybody going through the hell that is the recovery process.
Remember, it is not your fault! Where abuse is involved, albeit physical, sexual, mental, financial, spiritual etc......the fault never, ever lies with the victim....

View attachment 57915


“You unknowingly lived and loved what can only be described as an abhorrent liar and con artist – but you believed in them completely and spent a great deal of time and energy supporting, nurturing and developing this relationship. So, to start off you are not grieving a relationship that is traditional by any means – you are grieving an abusive and desperate love! Not only are you dealing with a lie, but with a creature that has damaged your life and abused your love – BUT again you BELIEVED in this person that completely destroyed you and probably took your integrity along for the ride. YOU are not at fault for any of this – NOBODY deserves to be lied to, conned, OR abused for any reason.

Now the truth is standing directly in front of you and you must SOMEHOW process this without any experience to do so. Where do you begin and how do you grieve this abusive relationship? You try to approach it like a normal relationship, BUT there is nothing even near normal about it. You have to make sense out of a love you BELIEVED was real, but it was a lie AND it was abuse. The two don’t go hand in hand. You can’t realistically find common ground to separate and actualize these two facts because they are so polar opposite and it feels impossible to work with this because you only end up conflicted.

On top of it all this abuse has left you vulnerable, traumatized and disabled. Today you stand at the bottom of a dark void looking for the smallest ray of light, but you are buried by so many layers of confusion that it feels impossible to do anything but remain there and wait for something or someone to help you or even save you. You can’t apply a traditional grieving process to any of this because you have been managed down from the abuse, you are traumatized and a shell of the person you once were. You are not moving on with a clear perspective and mutual and respectful understanding that the relationship failed, you are moving on from an abusive situation. YOU ARE NOT AT FAULT – so start there to get you healthy power back!

Even the people nearest and dearest to you can only console you from their point of view that doesn’t have the smallest connection to understanding this abuse. They don’t even know that you have fallen so deeply into this void. If you would have actually fallen into a hole the first thing you would do is use your voice and cry out for help! This is what you must actualize as the first step to moving forward – your voice is integral in getting a message out to the world that you need help, so you CAN connect to the very people that have experience to help you UNDERSTAND this! You cannot isolate yourself and remain in the fog any longer – this is YOUR time to survive and even thrive in time!

The very next thing that you have to actualize at some point is that there is absolutely nothing that you can do to try to make this love (be it a relationship or family member) real again by returning to it for any reason. You can’t fix the Narcissist that did this to you, relate to them in any manner, and or be in any contact with them anymore UNLESS it is an absolute necessity. You must also get them out of your thoughts as in TRYING to figure this out. Their words (and actions of course) are what abused you in the first place, so they have no sympathy as it concerns your situation because they purposely put you there. YES, this is excruciatingly painful to accept and nearly impossible to believe BUT you have to put yourself in the reality that this person (the Narcissist) is dangerous and you deserve so much more than this.

This is what defines the non-traditional breakup with these creatures. It is not a straightforward recovery, but instead one that requires a strong dose of education as well as a strong arm to pull the target/victim out of darkness and despair with therapy, support and all the help that is available. You are NOT just grieving a relationship, you are grieving so much personal destruction from abuse! No/minimal contact to START this journey.”
I can relate Mango:Cry::Cry:
 

AmberHeart

Lady Amberheart of Gafsa
Joined
Jul 13, 2018
Messages
4,593
Finally Free from Abuse at 62 Years Old :)

She is so beautiful, gorgeous personality. She has her own shine. As long as she tells her story she reminds me my mother when she talks about her life became all about and around her husbands’ career, that is the same thing my mother did. Suddenly I realize why I was willing to quit to everything for the rat, that is what I have seen as normal. :0 :| This gorgeous lady shows it is possible to recover yourself at any age, doesn’t matter when but to wake up. Loved it, gave me something else to think. Xx
 

DesertQuestion

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2018
Messages
62
Oh, and for any of you that lack a hope to see a narcissist “one upped” read how Cluster Bad’s find each other in love. The narcissist actually does have weakness... a big one in the BPD. So, cheer up and don’t despair, there’s a natural partner out there for every a**hole :love: :eek: :D

“In truth, the Narcissist is no match for the Borderline. It doesn't matter how smart or powerful he is, she'll turn his world upside-down to where he could lose his entire fortune, acquire a serious disease, and literally become a shadow of his former self.

The Narcissist's grandiosity works against him in this type of coupling, because he has an unquenchable need to win, due to poor self-worth he's endured and tried to compensate for since early childhood. He won't let himself be one-upped by anyone, but the Borderline is always better at this game than he is.

As the narcissistic male cannot tolerate any loss of control, he'll literally fight to the death to maintain it, never realizing what he's losing/giving up, in terms of his good health or monetary fortune while he's ultra-distracted, and obsessively immersed in surmounting the irresistible, intriguing challenges he faces with a borderline disordered partner.”
*waves, grins maniacally* :sneaky:
 
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