Rat or non rat?!

cheetopuff

Active Member
I need help with talking through my situation with a Tunisian male I met online. I *think* he’s not a rat, but I know we have some things that could be seen as red flags, including meeting online, and I know that everyone thinks their rat is not a rat at the start, so I still have a healthy dose of doubt too, but I don’t want to run away without being sure either. He doesn’t follow the usual rat signs, I don’t think, not from what I’ve read anyway, so it is a little confusing, or maybe he’s just extra good at his game.

We have been talking online for 3 months, we have not met yet, but we have loose plans to in a couple of months, however I want to have more clarity before that happens. We met online, of all places an online game, which I know is lame. I searched out and approached him, not knowing where he was from, or even if he could speak English. It so turned out that he could speak some English, his English is limited, but we are able to communicate well enough. The conversations started being about the game only, what we were playing, and then it led on from there.

The red flags I see include:
- I have been married before, I am currently separated
- I already have a child (she is 5)
- I am 4.5 years older
- I am from a western country
- He is well educated (masters degree), but is not employed at the moment, and has not had much work since his final degree in 2012
- He says he is poor and his family is poor and brothers and sisters are out of work too, but he also says it’s not as bad as before and they are ok
- He has worked in tourism in the summer when out of work, but in a theme park and washing dishes

We have talked about lots of different things - religion, our values, morals, beliefs, marriage, love, sex, kids, crime.

We have talked about marriage, not in a mad in love, can’t live without you way, but that if we develop into a relationship, then marriage is where we would end up because we cannot be together without being married. He is 29 and has had a girlfriend before (on / off girlfriend apparently) but tells me he has not committed zina, not even french kissed.

We talked about sex in terms of what is haram and halal in Islam. And whether, if we got together, any of those things would be issues. We asked questions that determined if we would be compatible or not. We’ve talked about kids and how they are very important to him, he said he could not be with me at one point when he thought I was saying I did not want anymore children, I said I was open to it, so we continued getting to know each other.

We’ve talked religion and how our two religions are similar and how they vary. Although I am not practicing in the religion I was raised in. I am reading the qu’ran out of my own interest. And when we discuss some topics he will quote scripture or Hadiths to me. He says he is a religious man and that he does not want to anger god.

When we talk about values and morals we talk about things like drinking alcohol, which he doesn’t, and I rarely do. We talk about eating pork, which again he doesn’t and it’s sometnkng I also rarely eat. We talk about parenting values, values in marriage, and much more. He encourages me and teaches me Arabic words and I am actually learning Arabic at a short course once a week where I live. He does not seem to hide behind his language. He has a Facebook which I only just accepted his friend request on last week, and the usual signs of lots of female friends is not the case.

We agreed to ask each other lots of hard questions so that we weren’t wasting each other’s time and money by meeting if we were to have such fundamental differences, which we don’t, and where we have we have talked through them and come to have an understanding of each other’s position and how we might compromise.

When we talk about feelings and love we admit that we like talking to each other and have fondness for each other, but we don’t talk about loving each other. We both know our feelings could be love or could develop into love, but that we cannot know that for sure online and that we have to meet first. And even then we talk about, even having 100% surety on feelings that this does not mean marriage would still work out, because we both know marriage takes more than just feelings. He has never said he doesn’t want a Tunisian woman, just that his previous girlfriend and him talked about marriage, but they both changed their minds. He has only said he wants someone that makes him laugh and loves him for who he is. He has said it doesn’t matter about culture (although he recognizes there is a lot different with our cultures which will take a lot of work) or religion (except that he could not marry someone who does not believe in god at all).

When we talk about what we’d do if we got married we talk about living in my country. I have a young daughter and so I told him I would not move to Tunisia and so that meant he had to come and live in my country. He is hesitant at the idea. He has a good understanding of his potential to earn here, but he also has a good understanding of expenses to live here, especially if he was supporting a family of his own. We did a dummy budget up so he could see all these expenses. He is hesitant because he says his number one goal is not marriage or family. His number one goal is to support his own family in Tunisia, because of their situation. And he aalso has a work goal that he feels would be more achievable in Tunisia than where I live, mostly due to the expenses of where I live. So he knows, while he could be paid well living here, that he would not have a lot left over to do his two goals - support his family and his work goal. So because of that he is saying he is hesitant to leave Tunisia and leave everything he knows behind.

He honestly seems like a good man, but I have read so many stories in here and elsewhere that leave doubt in my mind as some of those stories and the lengths these rats went to were horrific. He knows my concerns about bezness and does not try and convince me that he is not like that, instead he leaves it to me to make up my mind and agrees that it is hard for us both to know for sure when it is online. He does not ask me for anything, he does not play on his poorness, he does not push me to come and says it is ok if I do, and ok if I don’t, he understands. He wants me to come, but will not push it if I say I’m not sure.

Thanks for reading if you’ve got this far. Please throw all the questions at me. I need to work this out to know whether I should go meet him or not.
 

Lovelylondon

Well-Known Member
I need help with talking through my situation with a Tunisian male I met online. I *think* he’s not a rat, but I know we have some things that could be seen as red flags, including meeting online, and I know that everyone thinks their rat is not a rat at the start, so I still have a healthy dose of doubt too, but I don’t want to run away without being sure either. He doesn’t follow the usual rat signs, I don’t think, not from what I’ve read anyway, so it is a little confusing, or maybe he’s just extra good at his game.

We have been talking online for 3 months, we have not met yet, but we have loose plans to in a couple of months, however I want to have more clarity before that happens. We met online, of all places an online game, which I know is lame. I searched out and approached him, not knowing where he was from, or even if he could speak English. It so turned out that he could speak some English, his English is limited, but we are able to communicate well enough. The conversations started being about the game only, what we were playing, and then it led on from there.

The red flags I see include:
- I have been married before, I am currently separated
- I already have a child (she is 5)
- I am 4.5 years older
- I am from a western country
- He is well educated (masters degree), but is not employed at the moment, and has not had much work since his final degree in 2012
- He says he is poor and his family is poor and brothers and sisters are out of work too, but he also says it’s not as bad as before and they are ok
- He has worked in tourism in the summer when out of work, but in a theme park and washing dishes

We have talked about lots of different things - religion, our values, morals, beliefs, marriage, love, sex, kids, crime.

We have talked about marriage, not in a mad in love, can’t live without you way, but that if we develop into a relationship, then marriage is where we would end up because we cannot be together without being married. He is 29 and has had a girlfriend before (on / off girlfriend apparently) but tells me he has not committed zina, not even french kissed.

We talked about sex in terms of what is haram and halal in Islam. And whether, if we got together, any of those things would be issues. We asked questions that determined if we would be compatible or not. We’ve talked about kids and how they are very important to him, he said he could not be with me at one point when he thought I was saying I did not want anymore children, I said I was open to it, so we continued getting to know each other.

We’ve talked religion and how our two religions are similar and how they vary. Although I am not practicing in the religion I was raised in. I am reading the qu’ran out of my own interest. And when we discuss some topics he will quote scripture or Hadiths to me. He says he is a religious man and that he does not want to anger god.

When we talk about values and morals we talk about things like drinking alcohol, which he doesn’t, and I rarely do. We talk about eating pork, which again he doesn’t and it’s sometnkng I also rarely eat. We talk about parenting values, values in marriage, and much more. He encourages me and teaches me Arabic words and I am actually learning Arabic at a short course once a week where I live. He does not seem to hide behind his language. He has a Facebook which I only just accepted his friend request on last week, and the usual signs of lots of female friends is not the case.

We agreed to ask each other lots of hard questions so that we weren’t wasting each other’s time and money by meeting if we were to have such fundamental differences, which we don’t, and where we have we have talked through them and come to have an understanding of each other’s position and how we might compromise.

When we talk about feelings and love we admit that we like talking to each other and have fondness for each other, but we don’t talk about loving each other. We both know our feelings could be love or could develop into love, but that we cannot know that for sure online and that we have to meet first. And even then we talk about, even having 100% surety on feelings that this does not mean marriage would still work out, because we both know marriage takes more than just feelings. He has never said he doesn’t want a Tunisian woman, just that his previous girlfriend and him talked about marriage, but they both changed their minds. He has only said he wants someone that makes him laugh and loves him for who he is. He has said it doesn’t matter about culture (although he recognizes there is a lot different with our cultures which will take a lot of work) or religion (except that he could not marry someone who does not believe in god at all).

When we talk about what we’d do if we got married we talk about living in my country. I have a young daughter and so I told him I would not move to Tunisia and so that meant he had to come and live in my country. He is hesitant at the idea. He has a good understanding of his potential to earn here, but he also has a good understanding of expenses to live here, especially if he was supporting a family of his own. We did a dummy budget up so he could see all these expenses. He is hesitant because he says his number one goal is not marriage or family. His number one goal is to support his own family in Tunisia, because of their situation. And he aalso has a work goal that he feels would be more achievable in Tunisia than where I live, mostly due to the expenses of where I live. So he knows, while he could be paid well living here, that he would not have a lot left over to do his two goals - support his family and his work goal. So because of that he is saying he is hesitant to leave Tunisia and leave everything he knows behind.

He honestly seems like a good man, but I have read so many stories in here and elsewhere that leave doubt in my mind as some of those stories and the lengths these rats went to were horrific. He knows my concerns about bezness and does not try and convince me that he is not like that, instead he leaves it to me to make up my mind and agrees that it is hard for us both to know for sure when it is online. He does not ask me for anything, he does not play on his poorness, he does not push me to come and says it is ok if I do, and ok if I don’t, he understands. He wants me to come, but will not push it if I say I’m not sure.

Thanks for reading if you’ve got this far. Please throw all the questions at me. I need to work this out to know whether I should go meet him or not.
What is his name?
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
I don’t want to say in here. I can say via message. But for what reason, can someone look him up? I’ve tried searching for him in here, on the web and Facebook etc for his name and nothing has really come up, except a job page where he’s added a profile at some point.
 

Mango Chutney

Moderator
Staff member
I need help with talking through my situation with a Tunisian male I met online. I *think* he’s not a rat, but I know we have some things that could be seen as red flags, including meeting online, and I know that everyone thinks their rat is not a rat at the start, so I still have a healthy dose of doubt too, but I don’t want to run away without being sure either. He doesn’t follow the usual rat signs, I don’t think, not from what I’ve read anyway, so it is a little confusing, or maybe he’s just extra good at his game.

We have been talking online for 3 months, we have not met yet, but we have loose plans to in a couple of months, however I want to have more clarity before that happens. We met online, of all places an online game, which I know is lame. I searched out and approached him, not knowing where he was from, or even if he could speak English. It so turned out that he could speak some English, his English is limited, but we are able to communicate well enough. The conversations started being about the game only, what we were playing, and then it led on from there.

The red flags I see include:
- I have been married before, I am currently separated
- I already have a child (she is 5)
- I am 4.5 years older
- I am from a western country
- He is well educated (masters degree), but is not employed at the moment, and has not had much work since his final degree in 2012
- He says he is poor and his family is poor and brothers and sisters are out of work too, but he also says it’s not as bad as before and they are ok
- He has worked in tourism in the summer when out of work, but in a theme park and washing dishes

We have talked about lots of different things - religion, our values, morals, beliefs, marriage, love, sex, kids, crime.

We have talked about marriage, not in a mad in love, can’t live without you way, but that if we develop into a relationship, then marriage is where we would end up because we cannot be together without being married. He is 29 and has had a girlfriend before (on / off girlfriend apparently) but tells me he has not committed zina, not even french kissed.

We talked about sex in terms of what is haram and halal in Islam. And whether, if we got together, any of those things would be issues. We asked questions that determined if we would be compatible or not. We’ve talked about kids and how they are very important to him, he said he could not be with me at one point when he thought I was saying I did not want anymore children, I said I was open to it, so we continued getting to know each other.

We’ve talked religion and how our two religions are similar and how they vary. Although I am not practicing in the religion I was raised in. I am reading the qu’ran out of my own interest. And when we discuss some topics he will quote scripture or Hadiths to me. He says he is a religious man and that he does not want to anger god.

When we talk about values and morals we talk about things like drinking alcohol, which he doesn’t, and I rarely do. We talk about eating pork, which again he doesn’t and it’s sometnkng I also rarely eat. We talk about parenting values, values in marriage, and much more. He encourages me and teaches me Arabic words and I am actually learning Arabic at a short course once a week where I live. He does not seem to hide behind his language. He has a Facebook which I only just accepted his friend request on last week, and the usual signs of lots of female friends is not the case.

We agreed to ask each other lots of hard questions so that we weren’t wasting each other’s time and money by meeting if we were to have such fundamental differences, which we don’t, and where we have we have talked through them and come to have an understanding of each other’s position and how we might compromise.

When we talk about feelings and love we admit that we like talking to each other and have fondness for each other, but we don’t talk about loving each other. We both know our feelings could be love or could develop into love, but that we cannot know that for sure online and that we have to meet first. And even then we talk about, even having 100% surety on feelings that this does not mean marriage would still work out, because we both know marriage takes more than just feelings. He has never said he doesn’t want a Tunisian woman, just that his previous girlfriend and him talked about marriage, but they both changed their minds. He has only said he wants someone that makes him laugh and loves him for who he is. He has said it doesn’t matter about culture (although he recognizes there is a lot different with our cultures which will take a lot of work) or religion (except that he could not marry someone who does not believe in god at all).

When we talk about what we’d do if we got married we talk about living in my country. I have a young daughter and so I told him I would not move to Tunisia and so that meant he had to come and live in my country. He is hesitant at the idea. He has a good understanding of his potential to earn here, but he also has a good understanding of expenses to live here, especially if he was supporting a family of his own. We did a dummy budget up so he could see all these expenses. He is hesitant because he says his number one goal is not marriage or family. His number one goal is to support his own family in Tunisia, because of their situation. And he aalso has a work goal that he feels would be more achievable in Tunisia than where I live, mostly due to the expenses of where I live. So he knows, while he could be paid well living here, that he would not have a lot left over to do his two goals - support his family and his work goal. So because of that he is saying he is hesitant to leave Tunisia and leave everything he knows behind.

He honestly seems like a good man, but I have read so many stories in here and elsewhere that leave doubt in my mind as some of those stories and the lengths these rats went to were horrific. He knows my concerns about bezness and does not try and convince me that he is not like that, instead he leaves it to me to make up my mind and agrees that it is hard for us both to know for sure when it is online. He does not ask me for anything, he does not play on his poorness, he does not push me to come and says it is ok if I do, and ok if I don’t, he understands. He wants me to come, but will not push it if I say I’m not sure.

Thanks for reading if you’ve got this far. Please throw all the questions at me. I need to work this out to know whether I should go meet him or not.
Hi @cheetopuff, welcome to the forum....and well done for being sensible enough to come here :)

I'll not lie, I don't like what I read....signs are there!
You've already pointed out a few red flags yourself, but I have a few questions:
. After just three months online, why is marriage and sex even being discussed? He is a stranger that you've never met.

. How does he already know how expensive things are in your country? He must have already researched this....but why?

I do not know your employment status, but he knows that before him, you have been coping financially alone, he already says he wants to support his family....so does he think he can send any wages home, and you can still pay everything at your end? Rats have used this line before.

On a personal level, I will also add: My rat knew when he fished me online, that living there permanently was not an option for me, because of my children. He told me he didn't want to leave his country, family and friends etc.....so I went there with the sole aim of changing his mind and bringing him here.....turns out, this was his plan all along, but I saw through him before his hidden wish was granted. These men know that we can not raise Western children in a country that is not safe, has inadequate healthcare and education systems, a different language, culture and religion.
Don't ever play down the cultural differences...they are extreme.

. Me and my rat also did not declare love...not for many months and after we'd finally met in the flesh. He was still a rat.

. Would you convert to Islam? Seems to me, he is already working on this one.

At twenty nine, I very much doubt he is a virgin. Sexual behaviour in Tunisia is like nothing I've ever seen before....including those Tunisian 'virgin' girls.
Was his previous partner Tunisian?

Genuine Tunisian men will not discuss finances, nor tell you the family is poor...it is just not done to discuss this with a woman....especially a stranger on the internet. Rats have no pride, but genuine Tunisian men do.

If you visit, where will you stay?
 

Mango Chutney

Moderator
Staff member
- I have been married before, I am currently separated
Sorry, another question. It says you are separated, it doesn't mention divorce: Are you still legally married?
This was the same for me...I was still married, albeit on paper only....yet my rats morals were so shallow, he fished me online anyway, and we entered a relationship on meeting, though I rejected any sexual advances.
On paper only or not, it doesn't matter...I was still legally the wife of another man.....this is not acceptable in Tunisian culture.
 

Laura2014

Moderator
Staff member
Welcome @cheetopuff - great name. I too can see the same Red Flags @Mango Chutney has pointed out. In the beginning it starts out lovely and they seem very sincere and genuine. You think, he can’t be a rat. He’s so open and apparently honest.

Please read my thread “ if it’s your first time here read this”. You will find it in the on line rats thread.

Is he intending to stay with you when you visit him? Are you aware it’s not allowed for him to stay in your room or to rent an apartment together? In a hotel you have to book two rooms. It will be very expensive for him to stay in a hotel. The expectation will be that you will pay. Big red flag. He can’t stay with you in an apartment. He knows this. You both risk being informed on by disapproving neighbours and risk both of you being arrested. Equally you cannot stay at his home. If you are invited to stay there then 100% he’s a rat. It’s absolutly not done. He should pay for everything when you go there, if he’s not working he won’t be able to do that. My rat also claimed to have a masters degree! In fact he barely finished school andis destined for a life in the hotel trade. That you sought him out and contacted him I’d like a gift from Allah himself. There are so many questions you should be asking. There are many ways to search for information but we don’t write that in the forum, best to not give too much away. But later I’ll send you a PM.
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
Hi @cheetopuff, welcome to the forum....and well done for being sensible enough to come here :)

I'll not lie, I don't like what I read....signs are there!
You've already pointed out a few red flags yourself, but I have a few questions:
. After just three months online, why is marriage and sex even being discussed? He is a stranger that you've never met.

. How does he already know how expensive things are in your country? He must have already researched this....but why?

I do not know your employment status, but he knows that before him, you have been coping financially alone, he already says he wants to support his family....so does he think he can send any wages home, and you can still pay everything at your end? Rats have used this line before.

On a personal level, I will also add: My rat knew when he fished me online, that living there permanently was not an option for me, because of my children. He told me he didn't want to leave his country, family and friends etc.....so I went there with the sole aim of changing his mind and bringing him here.....turns out, this was his plan all along, but I saw through him before his hidden wish was granted. These men know that we can not raise Western children in a country that is not safe, has inadequate healthcare and education systems, a different language, culture and religion.
Don't ever play down the cultural differences...they are extreme.

. Me and my rat also did not declare love...not for many months and after we'd finally met in the flesh. He was still a rat.

. Would you convert to Islam? Seems to me, he is already working on this one.

At twenty nine, I very much doubt he is a virgin. Sexual behaviour in Tunisia is like nothing I've ever seen before....including those Tunisian 'virgin' girls.
Was his previous partner Tunisian?

Genuine Tunisian men will not discuss finances, nor tell you the family is poor...it is just not done to discuss this with a woman....especially a stranger on the internet. Rats have no pride, but genuine Tunisian men do.

If you visit, where will you stay?
Thank you :) and thank you for your response. I was hoping you’d read and respond after reading many of your other comments on here. I thought if anyone is a super hero to save against a rat mango chutney would be one! Haha

I’ll post some more info below that I’ve explained in pm to another member that will go through why we have talked about marriage already (my idea) and living expenses etc.

He has definitely said he would want to send money home and that if he could not be here, support a family here and also send money home, then he would not come. As being married is not enough for him. He wants to be married and support his own family. And so if he’s not guaranteed to do that here, it’s not enough to come here. He knows he could not send all wages home.

I don’t know if I would convert to Islam. I’ve no idea yet to be honest. I’m just curious and reading.

Yes he previous partner is Tunisian.

In my western head I thought 29 and virgin would be highly unlikely too, but then if he was true to his faith, it would not be so unlikely??

And yes I hear you on the cultural differences. I have some understanding but not enough, I really need to see it for myself in some aspects.

We have both discussed how we grew up poor. I grew up poor here. It came up in discussion on our values around charity and giving and how we both have seen help our families received when we were growing up. And that is when he said that it isn’t as bad as it was before. And that they are ok.
 
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cheetopuff

Active Member
And I know my feeling of “he is different” is very dangerous, but yet I can’t help but feel like that at the moment.

I play only that one game and not very often. And it is a game you cannot communicate in. It was me who went and searched on Facebook until I found his profile and sent the first message.

It was me who brought up marriage first. And like I said, it wasn’t in a I can’t live without you kind of way. It was more that I knew he was Muslim and know that means (if good Muslim) that marriage obviously is the goal for a relationship. So I told him I don’t want to waste time going there to meet him if we have fundamental differences that make us not compatible long term. So in that way we talked about marriage, so we could ask each other questions to really understand our values etc prior to me wanting to waste time to meet. He was the one saying we have not met and don’t rush etc. haha. But I’m just not into the idea of getting to know someone and then not being able to be with them because of religion and then realising we’d not be compatible long term anyway, where we could have known that earlier. I’m not sure if that makes sense.

And yes I have nothing to say re virgin and another mans child.

His degrees are in mechanical engineering.

Before we spoke about marriage etc. I was offering to help him see if he could come here on his own merits (ie skilled work visa or a sponsored work visa). We did do a bit of work on it but he decided to not pursue it. It was some time after this that we discussed why we were talking and forming a relationship and then marriage. So to me they don’t seem connected.

And yes I thought the same re talking about sex. But the sex talk is not sex talk id be expecting from a western man. It was more simply to get an understanding that I knew what would be haram for him and if we were compatible in that area too, like we discuss other things. He does not do smutty sex talk.

I did wonder about his Facebook not being his real Facebook as it’s under a different name. But I then wondered why his personal life would be on it at all if it wasn’t. Why his real life Tunisian girlfriend would be on it and why they would write comments to each other. Why his real life friends would post their camera club photos on it. If it wasn’t his real one then wouldn’t they do that on his real one and not his fake one?

He has not asked me about my financial situation. We have talked about a possible financial situation if he did come here and what he would earn and what things would cost. So he has asked about cost of rent etc here. But he does a lot of his own reading first and then seeks clarification from me on things. He did ask how I only work part time and manage to live once he realised that living costs were expensive here, but did not pry for specifics when I answered only by saying that we manage.

Yes I’m sure all Muslims would love the extra points being the one to convert a non Muslim lol but again I am choosing to read for myself. I was asking him lots of questions about religion and he ended up telling me that if I wanted to know I should read the qu’ran for myself. He does not push this and rarely even ask me about it. It is entirely up to me, he’s happy for me to go to him with questions, but he is not pushing me, not even covertly, to become Muslim. He’s supporting my own curiosity’s and telling me to find out for myself, and not to take his word. His comment about not marrying someone who doesn’t believe in god I don’t think was to test me, it is written in the qu’ran that a believer must marry a believer (faith doesn’t matter, just that they believe in god). Rather than testing me, I think it’s a true comment about what anyone he is with would need to have in order for him to be with them.

No, he did not offer to stay with his family in Tunisia. I will find my own accomodation. He did ask if he could stay with me a couple of nights, not in the same room, but just in the same apartment, and that his sister would stay with us in order for him to be able to come.

And yes, he’s been very honest about his number one goal in life being able to support his Tunisian family and to give back to them what they have given to him. If he can do this while supporting his own family then this would be ideal for him, but if he cannot do both then committing to supporting his own family comes first. So he’s already said he could not come here if he could not do both - not support a new family here if that’s where we worked towards, and his own. He is hesitant to the idea of marriage and a baby if he cannot support his own family, because he said himself if he gets married and has a kid then his new family would need to become his number 1 priority which then means he can’t support his own family in Tunisia which is something he does not want to not be able to do. So in other words he’s already said he would not come if he could not do both, that marriage and family here is not enough to come here, that he could do that there, and support his family (if his work goal worked out, and if it didn’t, he’d be happier knowing he tried everything there).
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
Sorry, another question. It says you are separated, it doesn't mention divorce: Are you still legally married?
This was the same for me...I was still married, albeit on paper only....yet my rats morals were so shallow, he fished me online anyway, and we entered a relationship on meeting, though I rejected any sexual advances.
On paper only or not, it doesn't matter...I was still legally the wife of another man.....this is not acceptable in Tunisian culture.
Yes still legally married. And yes I should have listed this in my red flags as I have wondered about this too.
 

Heidi

Inactive
He has definitely said he would want to send money home and that if he could not be here, support a family here and also send money home, then he would not come. As being married is not enough for him. He wants to be married and support his own family. And so if he’s not guaranteed to do that here, it’s not enough to come here. He knows he could not send all wages home.
Sounds to me that if you have enough money he'll marry you :whistle:
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
Welcome @cheetopuff - great name. I too can see the same Red Flags @Mango Chutney has pointed out. In the beginning it starts out lovely and they seem very sincere and genuine. You think, he can’t be a rat. He’s so open and apparently honest.

Please read my thread “ if it’s your first time here read this”. You will find it in the on line rats thread.

Is he intending to stay with you when you visit him? Are you aware it’s not allowed for him to stay in your room or to rent an apartment together? In a hotel you have to book two rooms. It will be very expensive for him to stay in a hotel. The expectation will be that you will pay. Big red flag. He can’t stay with you in an apartment. He knows this. You both risk being informed on by disapproving neighbours and risk both of you being arrested. Equally you cannot stay at his home. If you are invited to stay there then 100% he’s a rat. It’s absolutly not done. He should pay for everything when you go there, if he’s not working he won’t be able to do that. My rat also claimed to have a masters degree! In fact he barely finished school andis destined for a life in the hotel trade. That you sought him out and contacted him I’d like a gift from Allah himself. There are so many questions you should be asking. There are many ways to search for information but we don’t write that in the forum, best to not give too much away. But later I’ll send you a PM.
Thank you Laura. You’re another rat fighting super hero I was hoping would read and comment. I need the hard lines I expected to get in here :)

I have read your thread before but I will read it again. I read so much it all starts blurring into one.

I have now written above his intentions when I go there. I have not been offered to stay with the family. I am finding my own accomodation, he has asked if he could stay with me, not in the same room, but same apartment, for a couple of nights, and that his sister would need to come stay too for him to do this.

I look forward to your PM. Thank you.
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
Sounds to me that if you have enough money he'll marry you :whistle:
It does. I know. But I don’t. He knows he will have to work to do that and it’ll be his wage alone that would need to support us and his family. Hence why if his wage is not enough he would not come.
 

Liona

Rat Expert
Yes still legally married.
he does not want to anger god.
Being flirting in such a way with a married woman does not he anger a God already?:confused:
This is bad sign, because friend of mine had been in the same situation: her Tunisian "love" was going to marry her. She had been going through the tough phase of her family relationships then. The fact she was married did not embarrassed him.
 

Mango Chutney

Moderator
Staff member
Thank you :) and thank you for your response. I was hoping you’d read and respond after reading many of your other comments on here. I thought if anyone is a super hero to save against a rat mango chutney would be one! Haha
Hahaha, well thank you most kindly :love:
Now I'm gonna be evil....I'm going to completely pick apart everything you've written, so apologies in advance, as when I work from quotes, my replies become uber long...and I will work from all your posts, not just the one for me :p

I will start with this...because it made me angry (not with you)....and forced me to have an extra cigarette:
He is hesitant to the idea of marriage and a baby if he cannot support his own family, because he said himself if he gets married and has a kid then his new family would need to become his number 1 priority which then means he can’t support his own family in Tunisia
Omfg, how disgusting is that!!! When a man of ANY nationality marries, his WIFE becomes his number one priority, she is his responsibility and should be his number one.
When a man of ANY nationality marries a woman with a child(ren), THEY become his family, his responsibility, his number one....not his Tunisian family.
As a mother myself, I would kick any man to the kerb that did not live by these values and treat my children as his own...hence Houssem never being allowed to meet my boys.
Does his father work? If yes, his wife and children are his responsibility. Any money that his grown children are able to send to him should be a bonus, not a guarantee.
Are his brothers adults? If yes, as Tunisian men, they too would muck in financially to ensure a decent quality of life for the parents, though the firstborn son mostly gets the majority of this responsibility. Once married, his sisters become the responsibility of their husbands, but they also help the mother with stuff like cleaning, cooking, healthcare etc. I have no idea how many siblings your fella has, but the responsibility is not his alone.
His attitude sucks :thumbsup:
He has definitely said he would want to send money home and that if he could not be here, support a family here and also send money home, then he would not come.
I don't believe this for one moment. I firmly believe he would send money home, even if that means you and your little'un go without, but no way do I believe he would not accept a visa to your country...what a load of rubbish :D
There is at least one rat that told his victim (after she got him a visa) "You lived without my money before I came, why do you need my money now?", yet prior to the visa, he told her she would never need to work again, that he would support her :rolleyes: He called her a thief, accused her of stealing his money and his "Golden years".... as if he was forced!
They think in our countries, they will get high flying city jobs, wages like a movie star etc...they can't see that most of them remain unemployed ponces, or get menial, low paying jobs like cleaners, waiters etc..they live in a utopia, created by their deluded visions.
Your fella may be pretending to have morals and principles, but personally...I don't believe a word of it. It's your call....but I think he is trying to paint himself as almost saintly, to convince you he isn't using you. This is just my opinion though, based on what you've written and my gut.
I don’t know if I would convert to Islam. I’ve no idea yet to be honest. I’m just curious and reading.
Yes I’m sure all Muslims would love the extra points being the one to convert a non Muslim lol but again I am choosing to read for myself. I was asking him lots of questions about religion and he ended up telling me that if I wanted to know I should read the qu’ran for myself. He does not push this and rarely even ask me about it. It is entirely up to me, he’s happy for me to go to him with questions, but he is not pushing me, not even covertly, to become Muslim. He’s supporting my own curiosity’s and telling me to find out for myself, and not to take his word. His comment about not marrying someone who doesn’t believe in god I don’t think was to test me, it is written in the qu’ran that a believer must marry a believer (faith doesn’t matter, just that they believe in god). Rather than testing me, I think it’s a true comment about what anyone he is with would need to have in order for him to be with them.
This is all painfully familiar. My rat did not push his religion on me, he said just enough to raise my levels of curiosity and then told me I must ask questions, that it must be my wish to learn. I ask many questions, I learned a lot about Islam from him...but not the bits that would have made me question his being with me....he carefully skirted around that stuff....I learned more after I left him.

I tried to understand Islam because the culture I was living in was dictated to by it. That culture took away many of my Western freedoms and I needed an understanding. I was not allowed out alone, was mostly not allowed out at all, my clothes were dictated, my educated opinions ignored, I had to smoke discreetly if out and about, my family were slowly alienated from me, I became his possession....it is no life for an educated, independent, Western female. Elements of this control will slowly sneak into your life too.
Are you willing to accept this? Were you interested in Islam before him?

When I finally left my rat for good (he didn't know this), I was gifted with a Qur'an and a little compass, so I always knew which direction Mecca is....the religion is slowly incorporated into our lives.
As a teetotal vegetarian, with much confusion over religion and a natural curiosity, I was the perfect candidate to be subtly worked on....and it seems you are too :(
In my western head I thought 29 and virgin would be highly unlikely too, but then if he was true to his faith, it would not be so unlikely??
No, in fact...it is highly unlikely. Tunisia has the most sexually active culture I've ever known.
A rat firmly believes that Allah forgives all.
A rat believes a shower after sex protects them from diseases, after unprotected sex with men and women. A rat believes if he turns the light out, Allah cannot see him.
A rat believes that if he gives, rather than recieves....he is not gay.
They are foolish creatures that believe they can do as they wish, as after marriage, or with age...they will live a devoutly religious life and Allah will forgive them.
Alcohol, sex outside of marriage, drugs, swearing etc are all haram behaviours, but this brainwashing from birth tells them that it is fine.
A Tunisian virgin is a very rare thing indeed and there is no shortage of surgically reconstructed hymens in Tunisia.
Even those that save their hymen are engaging in oral, anal, partial penetration, dry humping etc. These are natural behaviours in a relationship and not something I hold against them, what I hold against them is the lies, the fake morals, the belief that their women are better than ours. The fact is, regardless of which kinda sex they indulge in, they are still sexually active...and their men have the same needs as ours.
Kissing happens, including French kissing...I fail to see the point in him even lying about this.

My rat told me he did not masturbate. This lie went on for ages until I said "FFS, stop lying...it's completely natural! I have brothers, I have teenage sons...it's nothing to be ashamed of". Eventually, he not only told me the truth...but sent me a video of him doing it!
We have both discussed how we grew up poor. I grew up poor here.
He won't believe you. In his mind, you have a home, you raise your daughter on a single, part time wage, you have a phone, maybe a car, a TV, you can afford flights, a decent wardrobe of clothes etc....in their minds, no matter what we say, they think we are minted because we have more than them. They think we are all wealthy, that our government throw copious volumes of free cash in our directions, and no matter how you try to convince him, or what he says to make you think he believes you, it is not true...in his heart, he does not believe you.
Because I lived in Tunisia, I clearly see the difference between their lives and ours, and because of that...I understand why they all foolishly believe we are rich...regardless of our words to the contrary.
His degrees are in mechanical engineering.
His degree has the same value as Tesco value toilet paper in the Western world...it is nothing. Their education is good for an African country, but not good enough to ensure a good job in our countries. He will get to your country under the belief that he will find a fantastic, well paid job in mechanical engineering...but he won't, and then depression kicks in, it will be your fault, blah blah. These deluded fools need to realise that there is not enough employment for our own people....that we can't employ Africa too.
And I know my feeling of “he is different” is very dangerous, but yet I can’t help but feel like that at the moment.
Ya....we all believed that once upon a time. Maybe yours is different...but I don't think so.

I cannot understand why after a three month internet connection, that initially revolved around playing a game, you have already moved onto discussing marriage, family, responsibilities, sending money to Tunisia (him), employment, sex etc. These are personal matters generally discussed within a relationship or with trusted friends and family members...not with online strangers. The fact that he discusses these things with you and you cannot see it is wrong, is a big sign that you do not understand his culture. Man does not do this in Tunisia.

Here, I will give you a couple of examples of my experiences. Houssem was my rat, Raghed his brother.
Raghed to me: Look Stoopid, new girlfriend (FB pic shown), you like?
Me to Raghed: Yes, she's pretty, what is her name, how old is she?
Raghed to me: Her name is {insert name}, she is {insert age} years old.
Me to Raghed: Where does she live? When is her birthday? Does she have brothers and sisters?
Raghed to me: I don't know :confused:
Me to Houssem: That's weird really, he doesn't know anything about his new girlfriend.
Houssem to me: You are so nosey, all the foreign people are, we don't ask these questions here, it is not our business.

To me, my innocent questions were natural, they kept a conversation going, but they didn't even discuss these things, let alone marriage, sex and financial responsibilities!

Another example:
(This was after the first time Houssem assaulted me)
Me: You need to see a head doctor, I will not stay if you don't, what you did was not normal (there is a description on another thread of his first assault).
Him: I'll do anything, blah blah, sob sob :rolleyes:
Me: How will you get there?
Him: I will go in the taxi with my dad when he goes to work.
Me: Won't be ask where you are going so early?
Him: (horrified face) No, of course not, it's not his business, he will not ask.
Three weeks later, same scenario:
Me: Surely your dad must now be wondering where the hell you are going every Friday morning...and now I'm going too :confused:
Him: Maybe he will wonder, but he still will not ask... Tunisian people are not like that, we keep our private lives private.

Now for me, if my son kept leaping in a taxi with me every Friday morning, and one week...bought his girlfriend with him, I would naturally ask: Oh, where are you off to? Is all ok? What are your plans for today? etc.
For us, this is regular conversation....for them...it is not normal. Do you see?

I'll call this comment quits for now, as I'm losing my way between comments and housework :D
But I hope you get my drift. In my honest opinion, the picture he paints of himself is far too pretty to be true :thumbsup:
 
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cheetopuff

Active Member
Hahaha, well thank you most kindly :love:
Now I'm gonna be evil....I'm going to completely pick apart everything you've written, so apologies in advance, as when I work from quotes, my replies become uber long...and I will work from all your posts, not just the one for me :p

I will start with this...because it made me angry (not with you)....and forced me to have an extra cigarette:

Omfg, how disgusting is that!!! When a man of ANY nationality marries, his WIFE becomes his number one priority, she is his responsibility and should be his number one.
When a man of ANY nationality marries a woman with a child(ren), THEY become his family, his responsibility, his number one....not his Tunisian family.
As a mother myself, I would kick any man to the kerb that did not live by these values and treat my children as his own...hence Houssem never being allowed to meet my boys.
Does his father work? If yes, his wife and children are his responsibility. Any money that his grown children are able to send to him should be a bonus, not a guarantee.
Are his brothers adults? If yes, as Tunisian men, they too would muck in financially to ensure a decent quality of life for the parents, though the firstborn son mostly gets the majority of this responsibility. Once married, his sisters become the responsibility of their husbands, but they also help the mother with stuff like cleaning, cooking, healthcare etc. I have no idea how many siblings your fella has, but the responsibility is not his alone.
His attitude sucks :thumbsup:

I don't believe this for one moment. I firmly believe he would send money home, even if that means you and your little'un go without, but no way do I believe he would not accept a visa to your country...what a load of rubbish :D
There is at least one rat that told his victim (after she got him a visa) "You lived without my money before I came, why do you need my money now?", yet prior to the visa, he told her she would never need to work again, that he would support her :rolleyes: He called her a thief, accused her of stealing his money and his "Golden years".... as if he was forced!
They think in our countries, they will get high flying city jobs, wages like a movie star etc...they can't see that most of them remain unemployed ponces, or get menial, low paying jobs like cleaners, waiters etc..they live in a utopia, created by their deluded visions.
Your fella may be pretending to have morals and principles, but personally...I don't believe a word of it. It's your call....but I think he is trying to paint himself as almost saintly, to convince you he isn't using you. This is just my opinion though, based on what you've written and my gut.



This is all painfully familiar. My rat did not push his religion on me, he said just enough to raise my levels of curiosity and then told me I must ask questions, that it must be my wish to learn. I ask many questions, I learned a lot about Islam from him...but not the bits that would have made me question his being with me....he carefully skirted around that stuff....I learned more after I left him.

I tried to understand Islam because the culture I was living in was dictated to by it. That culture took away many of my Western freedoms and I needed an understanding. I was not allowed out alone, was mostly not allowed out at all, my clothes were dictated, my educated opinions ignored, I had to smoke discreetly if out and about, my family were slowly alienated from me, I became his possession....it is no life for an educated, independent, Western female. Elements of this control will slowly sneak into your life too.
Are you willing to accept this? Were you interested in Islam before him?

When I finally left my rat for good (he didn't know this), I was gifted with a Qur'an and a little compass, so I always knew which direction Mecca is....the religion is slowly incorporated into our lives.
As a teetotal vegetarian, with much confusion over religion and a natural curiosity, I was the perfect candidate to be subtly worked on....and it seems you are too :(

No, in fact...it is highly unlikely. Tunisia has the most sexually active culture I've ever known.
A rat firmly believes that Allah forgives all.
A rat believes a shower after sex protects them from diseases, after unprotected sex with men and women. A rat believes if he turns the light out, Allah cannot see him.
A rat believes that if he gives, rather than recieves....he is not gay.
They are foolish creatures that believe they can do as they wish, as after marriage, or with age...they will live a devoutly religious life and Allah will forgive them.
Alcohol, sex outside of marriage, drugs, swearing etc are all haram behaviours, but this brainwashing from birth tells them that it is fine.
A Tunisian virgin is a very rare thing indeed and there is no shortage of surgically reconstructed hymens in Tunisia.
Even those that save their hymen are engaging in oral, anal, partial penetration, dry humping etc. These are natural behaviours in a relationship and not something I hold against them, what I hold against them is the lies, the fake morals, the belief that their women are better than ours. The fact is, regardless of which kinda sex they indulge in, they are still sexually active...and their men have the same needs as ours.
Kissing happens, including French kissing...I fail to see the point in him even lying about this.

My rat told me he did not masturbate. This lie went on for ages until I said "FFS, stop lying...it's completely natural! I have brothers, I have teenage sons...it's nothing to be ashamed of". Eventually, he not only told me the truth...but sent me a video of him doing it!

He won't believe you. In his mind, you have a home, you raise your daughter on a single, part time wage, you have a phone, maybe a car, a TV, you can afford flights, a decent wardrobe of clothes etc....in their minds, no matter what we say, they think we are minted because we have more than them. They think we are all wealthy, that our government throw copious volumes of free cash in our directions, and no matter how you try to convince him, or what he says to make you think he believes you, it is not true...in his heart, he does not believe you.
Because I lived in Tunisia, I clearly see the difference between their lives and ours, and because of that...I understand why they all foolishly believe we are rich...regardless of our words to the contrary.

His degree has the same value as Tesco value toilet paper in the Western world...it is nothing. Their education is good for an African country, but not good enough to ensure a good job in our countries. He will get to your country under the belief that he will find a fantastic, well paid job in mechanical engineering...but he won't, and then depression kicks in, it will be your fault, blah blah. These deluded fools need to realise that there is not enough employment for our own people....that we can't employ Africa too.

Ya....we all believed that once upon a time. Maybe yours is different...but I don't think so.

I cannot understand why after a three month internet connection, that initially revolved around playing a game, you have already moved onto discussing marriage, family, responsibilities, sending money to Tunisia (him), employment, sex etc. These are personal matters generally discussed within a relationship or with trusted friends and family members...not with online strangers. The fact that he discusses these things with you and you cannot see it is wrong, is a big sign that you do not understand his culture. Man does not do this in Tunisia.

Here, I will give you a couple of examples of my experiences. Houssem was my rat, Raghed his brother.
Raghed to me: Look Stoopid, new girlfriend (FB pic shown), you like?
Me to Raghed: Yes, she's pretty, what is her name, how old is she?
Raghed to me: Her name is {insert name}, she is {insert age} years old.
Me to Raghed: Where does she live? When is her birthday? Does she have brothers and sisters?
Raghed to me: I don't know :confused:
Me to Houssem: That's weird really, he doesn't know anything about his new girlfriend.
Houssem to me: You are so nosey, all the foreign people are, we don't ask these questions here, it is not our business.

To me, my innocent questions were natural, they kept a conversation going, but they didn't even discuss these things, let alone marriage, sex and financial responsibilities!

Another example:
(This was after the first time Houssem assaulted me)
Me: You need to see a head doctor, I will not stay if you don't, what you did was not normal (there is a description on another thread of his first assault).
Him: I'll do anything, blah blah, sob sob :rolleyes:
Me: How will you get there?
Him: I will go in the taxi with my dad when he goes to work.
Me: Won't be ask where you are going so early?
Him: (horrified face) No, of course not, it's not his business, he will not ask.
Three weeks later, same scenario:
Me: Surely your dad must now be wondering where the hell you are going every Friday morning...and now I'm going too :confused:
Him: Maybe he will wonder, but he still will not ask... Tunisian people are not like that, we keep our private lives private.

Now for me, if my son kept leaping in a taxi with me every Friday morning, and one week...bought his girlfriend with him, I would naturally ask: Oh, where are you off to? Is all ok? What are your plans for today? etc.
For us, this is regular conversation....for them...it is not normal. Do you see?

I'll call this comment quits for now, as I'm losing my way between comments and housework :D
But I hope you get my drift. In my honest opinion, the picture he paints of himself is far too pretty to be true :thumbsup:
And it’s ok, that’s what I’m here for, to have my thoughts picked apart, as uncomfortable as it is. So thank you for your time!

And yes, he knows and agrees that his own/new family needs to be his number one responsibility if he married. That is why he is hesitant to marry.

His father is not working. He has other siblings but has said some are out of work. I don’t know how many work and how many don’t. I know about the eldest son being more responsible, but I’ve not specifically asked that. He is the second youngest out of 7 (4 boys).

I know where you come from about saying his trying to paint himself as saintly. I never did get this feeling from him though. He admits his faults and says he’s only learning. He is seemingly quite humble. But I know, I know...!!

In my country mechanical engineering is a sought after skilled worker. There is a process where he would need to get his qualifications approved by the engingeering board here, but it is not impossible. If he had enough years work experience, based on his age and his qualifications he could get his own visa here. But I digress.

I hope it’s me defending back. It’s the only way I think I’m going to work all this out.

I do not send him money. And the change in conversation to more serious matters was directed by me. I don’t want to waste my time getting to know someone where there is no future, something that could have been seen upfront. I brought this up in conversation when I realised I was enjoying his “company” and I realised I didn’t want it to build and continue into nothingness. I can’t explain it well. But I either wanted it to end and not get all confused and mopey after even longer talking, or I wanted to know that IF we met and all was ok and IF we wanted to start a relationship, that there was a potential future. That huge factors like religion, which country to live in, finanes, life goals etc were compatible. We felt like friends. Even despite the short time. I know it sounds crazy.

We talked about things like birthdays and siblings and hobbies and all that stuff as well. It’s not just been marriage and serious things.

Yes I was interested in Islam before I met him. But sure meeting and being able to discuss it with someone in the faith does drive the curiosity more. Have you finished reading the qu’ran yet? I have not. But I am works through it.

He’s online now and I’m asking him why is it ok for him to want someone older, with a child to another man, who’s obviously not a virgin. And if it is not shameful for him to speak to someone who is still legally married.

His answer was that why am I asking things I have already asked and why we need to talk about it again. He accepted that I have doubts and so he has answered again. And his answer is that it is ok in his religion...not being a virgin and having a child. And so because it’s ok in his religion it is ok with him and he has no problem with it. It was the same answer he gave me originally.
 

Heidi

Inactive
His degree has the same value as Tesco value toilet paper in the Western world...it is nothing. Their education is good for an African country, but not good enough to ensure a good job in our countries. He will get to your country under the belief that he will find a fantastic, well paid job in mechanical engineering...but he won't, and then depression kicks in, it will be your fault, blah blah.
especially since he had no job in his field for the last few years (if at all) and

It so turned out that he could speak some English, his English is limited, but we are able to communicate well enough.
 

Liona

Rat Expert
but I think he is trying to paint himself as almost saintly, to convince you he isn't using you. This is just my opinion though, based on what you've written and my gut.
It's not just your opinion. I was thinking exactly the same, and I did not like this at all.

And one more thing.. I am sorry in advance, I could be terribly mistaken, but from what I have read, it seemed to me (it's just my feeling), @cheetopuff, you are more interested in him than he is in you. He puts forward quite enough the requirements, but does not make the real steps towards you. Let's say his offer to participate in your travel costs would be nice for a start. Yes, I remember he is kind of poor man who are passing his time playing on-line games, but what kind of relationships it would be with such a man??
 

Mango Chutney

Moderator
Staff member
I have now written above his intentions when I go there. I have not been offered to stay with the family. I am finding my own accomodation, he has asked if he could stay with me, not in the same room, but same apartment, for a couple of nights, and that his sister would need to come stay too for him to do this.
Sorry....this bit too :D I find more every time I read.
If he wishes to come and stay with you in an apartment, am I right to assume he is paying the rent money, to accommodate you and his sister? Is he providing the food? These are his responsibilities as a Tunisian man. You will need a three bed apartment too (unless he sleeps on the sofa and his sister sleeps with you), or you run the risk of being arrested for prostitution.
Has he told you all of this?
That is why he is hesitant to marry.
If he is hesitant to marry, why is he wooing you this way? :confused:
He's already made it clear that his religion means no sexual relations before marriage....this will force you into a fast marriage, as we all have natural needs and trust me....he will ensure you fall madly in love with him at first meeting :rolleyes:
In my country mechanical engineering is a sought after skilled worker. There is a process where he would need to get his qualifications approved by the engingeering board here, but it is not impossible. If he had enough years work experience, based on his age and his qualifications he could get his own visa here.
I doubt it. Our government's are very aware of what's going on, they are not giving out visas easily.
You said his language skills in English are poor, I'm not sure what country you are from, but English appears to be your mother tongue, so how can he work there? :confused:
He has zero work experience in his field...he knows full damn well that his qualification will not get him a visa, just as, regardless of his words to the contrary, my rat knew full damn well that he couldn't get a visa to my country on his music card. They tell us this to make us relax, to make us believe we are not an easy visa.
His answer was that why am I asking things I have already asked and why we need to talk about it again. He accepted that I have doubts and so he has answered again. And his answer is that it is ok in his religion...not being a virgin and having a child. And so because it’s ok in his religion it is ok with him and he has no problem with it. It was the same answer he gave me originally.
Seems like an easy way out to me...religious acceptances, cultural differences, blah blah....I would push further. I would also ask him how he could pay for a wedding, a visa, flights, passport etc :thumbsup:
 

Brasilgirl

Senior Rat Expert
And it’s ok, that’s what I’m here for, to have my thoughts picked apart, as uncomfortable as it is. So thank you for your time!

And yes, he knows and agrees that his own/new family needs to be his number one responsibility if he married. That is why he is hesitant to marry.

His father is not working. He has other siblings but has said some are out of work. I don’t know how many work and how many don’t. I know about the eldest son being more responsible, but I’ve not specifically asked that. He is the second youngest out of 7 (4 boys).

I know where you come from about saying his trying to paint himself as saintly. I never did get this feeling from him though. He admits his faults and says he’s only learning. He is seemingly quite humble. But I know, I know...!!

In my country mechanical engineering is a sought after skilled worker. There is a process where he would need to get his qualifications approved by the engingeering board here, but it is not impossible. If he had enough years work experience, based on his age and his qualifications he could get his own visa here. But I digress.

I hope it’s me defending back. It’s the only way I think I’m going to work all this out.

I do not send him money. And the change in conversation to more serious matters was directed by me. I don’t want to waste my time getting to know someone where there is no future, something that could have been seen upfront. I brought this up in conversation when I realised I was enjoying his “company” and I realised I didn’t want it to build and continue into nothingness. I can’t explain it well. But I either wanted it to end and not get all confused and mopey after even longer talking, or I wanted to know that IF we met and all was ok and IF we wanted to start a relationship, that there was a potential future. That huge factors like religion, which country to live in, finanes, life goals etc were compatible. We felt like friends. Even despite the short time. I know it sounds crazy.

We talked about things like birthdays and siblings and hobbies and all that stuff as well. It’s not just been marriage and serious things.

Yes I was interested in Islam before I met him. But sure meeting and being able to discuss it with someone in the faith does drive the curiosity more. Have you finished reading the qu’ran yet? I have not. But I am works through it.

He’s online now and I’m asking him why is it ok for him to want someone older, with a child to another man, who’s obviously not a virgin. And if it is not shameful for him to speak to someone who is still legally married.

His answer was that why am I asking things I have already asked and why we need to talk about it again. He accepted that I have doubts and so he has answered again. And his answer is that it is ok in his religion...not being a virgin and having a child. And so because it’s ok in his religion it is ok with him and he has no problem with it. It was the same answer he gave me originally.
My rat used to talk about me learning to cook and living in Tunisia married to him having kids, the whole deal. But I don’t cook or clean. I have people do that for me. I work and study. I travel between countries to visit friends and family. I have a busy lifestyle. I can’t be home bound with kids and cook and clean. I’d litterally go crazy. I told him that. So then the rat said he wanted to study in Canada to be nearer to me. I asked him what he wanted to study and he was unsure, but had ideas. Eventually he picked a school and program and started getting more info. He said he’d ask his brother for help with the cost. It seemed legit. So I started looking into funding a scholarship for him, to help him out. It’s not impossible for me to help him this way. I never told him that I would fund his education if he got accepted. But... soon after he started getting info and had to apply, he suddenly just stopped and told me he was going to stay in Tunisia and study something totally different.
Then he said he was ‘in a mood’ and stopped talking to me for a few days. That’s when I saw him in photos having a great time and drinking beer at a hotel resort in Hammamet with ‘the guys’. ‘In a mood’ he says!

What they say to you is one thing. What they do is another. They (the rats) lie and protect each other. And, sometimes the family is in on it, on Facebook, in person, it doesn’t matter. It’s all for the end goal: money and status.
They can be subtle until they know they got you hooked. Be careful with him. Rats will take their time and brainwash you and it’s the most difficult thing to recover from. He could be taking extra time with you because you ask good questions and he wants you to buy into his innocence.
Mine said he was a virgin too, but he was the biggest flirt, many Tunisian women, tourists, European women, American women, Canadian women, different ages, all supposedly just friends.
Rats are really good at keeping their real life secret. But they can slip up. Pay attention. And pass on his name and social media in a PM, if you haven’t yet.
 

cheetopuff

Active Member
It’s ok Liona, no need to apologize.

He has offered to borrow money from his family and friends so that he could have money in the bank to try and get a visa to come to visit me.

What other real steps would there be? If he came he’d be giving up his family, his friends, his culture, his community, his food, his homely habits, his comfort to be in a country where he could face racism and prejudice, possible isolation, especially initially. I think that is a big risk for someone already. And a lot to give. I could not do that all that easily. And I won’t. I will not move there. It has to be here. And he has to fit in with more western ideas of house running and marriage, because I am not giving up my hobbies and things I do away from the family currently.

I know it could all be different if it happens. It’s working out if his intentions are true or not.

And I can see the clues in how some are smelling a rat. I still don’t see it the same. I am either blinded or the rat is not there. But that is why I am here. I want to hear everyone’s opinions. I have not allowed him any additional treatment than how I would be with a local partner in the same situation.
 

Brasilgirl

Senior Rat Expert
It’s ok Liona, no need to apologize.

He has offered to borrow money from his family and friends so that he could have money in the bank to try and get a visa to come to visit me.

What other real steps would there be? If he came he’d be giving up his family, his friends, his culture, his community, his food, his homely habits, his comfort to be in a country where he could face racism and prejudice, possible isolation, especially initially. I think that is a big risk for someone already. And a lot to give. I could not do that all that easily. And I won’t. I will not move there. It has to be here. And he has to fit in with more western ideas of house running and marriage, because I am not giving up my hobbies and things I do away from the family currently.

I know it could all be different if it happens. It’s working out if his intentions are true or not.

And I can see the clues in how some are smelling a rat. I still don’t see it the same. I am either blinded or the rat is not there. But that is why I am here. I want to hear everyone’s opinions. I have not allowed him any additional treatment than how I would be with a local partner in the same situation.
But first don’t you have to go to Tunisia to meet him and get married?
 
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